What's done in the dark always comes to light. They are completely disconnected from operations and maintenance and some in the operation would argue 'reality' should be added to that list. Any altimeter setting mismatch is shown by a yellow line beneath the altimeter setting on the PFD, and the pressurized cabin is set to climb at 300 fpm. Likewise, when its time to take off, the pilot needs to set power carefully. The Nov. 16, 2011 engine failure and emergency landing at Flint, MI and veering off the runway and flipping on its back (all 4 occupants suffered minor injuries) shows pilot poor skills for sure and serious concern about engine maintenance. My trip has been scheduled for several days so I am perplexed on why they waited until 11pm the night before my trip to tell me about this issue. I kept on the controls through a number of heading changes much up into the midteens before switching on the autopilot. Had this been a 121 flight, the Captain could have had the passengers detained for interfering with a flight crew and stomping out on the supposedly "secured" ramp, but this isn't 121. At that level we were seeing 380 knots or Mach 0.664 on 600 pounds of jet-A per hour, not per side but total. Villi selected the Rockwell Collins RTA-800 weather radar on his nav display via the display control panel down the side of the PFD, to monitor a cell just inland. I followed the start procedure with one eye as I did this and observed Villi checking the power lever at idle, switching on the fuel pump, and setting the start switch to start. At 13 percent Ng, he moved the condition lever to ground idle with the starter switch shut off at 40 percent Ng and the power lever to flight idle. As the factory-authorized training provider for these aircraft, we have created in-depth, type-specific programs to ensure that pilots and technicians are equipped with the latest in safety training. Viewing this report requires Adobe Reader be installed on your device. One smart thing I did do was I bought my share as a resale thru a vendor and paid a whole lot less then I would have if I bought straight from Avantair. But that there are some management issues. 36 dated 11 April 2019 to the P.180 Avanti Pilot's Operating Handbook and AFM (Report 6591). They are a public company and having your fleet grounded is a material issue yet they are not disclosing this issue as far as I can tell. To demonstrate the low-speed aileron control, Lorenzo then pulled back to the buffet and effortlessly rolled on 80 degrees of bank and then recovered to level flight. By December 2020, 246 Piaggio P.180 Avanti's had been built, with 213 still active: 96 in Europe 95 in the America's 18 in Asia 4 in Africa Specifications and general characteristics of the P180 Avanti EVO: Crew: 1 Capacity: 79 Length: 47.3 feet Wingspan: 46.0 feet Height: 13.0 feet Wing area: 172 square feet] Empty weight: 8,375 lbs Neither ASN nor the Flight Safety Foundation are responsible for the completeness or correctness of this information. The professional pilots at Avantair greatly appreciate our owners support and contribution to our careers and livelihoods. Like the Starship, the Piaggio Avanti features a canard and rear-mounted engines. But the Avanti is made mostly of aluminum, not composites. It weighs thousands of pounds less than the Starship and is about 60 m.p.h. faster. ^ Martin, Ed (29 October 1989). Pilatus PC-12 or Piaggio P.180 Checklist? Yes. Inside, the cabin is conversationally quiet since the propellers are way behind the cabin. The biggest problem I had was in remembering that I wasnt flying a jet and that mounted 30 feet in back of me, completely out of sight, were two turboprop engines. Using the intuitive FMS CDU, I programmed a route toward BERAB, the initial approach fix for the VOR approach to Runway 27 at Villanova. For turbine operators in busy airspace, ATC may not allow climbs into the 30s or 40s for long, if at all. This, along with the airplanes great cabin and operating economies, has made the Avanti II the airplane that has helped create the remarkable success of charter and fractional operator Avantair, which operates 57 Avantis. This is another advantage of a turboprop. I flew with him last month. Taking back control as we lined up, Villi held the brakes using the top of the toe pedals, advanced the power levers to 97.6 percent, and we accelerated briskly to 120 knots. Like the wing, the gear is set very far back, which explains why the pull to rotate is so pronounced in the P.180. The lower section, containing two integral carpeted steps, is released by a handle on the left and lowered into position. So happy I left this rag tag joint when I did! The wings are held level easily with aileron and a squeeze of rudder. Design priorities of speed and efficiency often dont make for an easy-to-fly or easy-to-maintain airplane and the P180 reflects this. I am disappointed that there has been no communication out to the owners about this grounding and if you go to their website it doesn't mention anything and it looks like business as usual. No furloughs or termination?? Thank you! An FAA spokeswoman told me that the grounding was not initiated by the agency, so Im not sure where you got this information. But, I'm sure that you could have done much better. Length / 47 ft 3 in The anhedral of the forward wing ensures there is no aerodynamic interference with the engine intakes and assists in stall handling. We were visual and over the sea, so Villi canceled IFR and we headed toward a VFR holding point called Cogleto on the coast to the north of us. A traffic target can be out of view in certain positions, at around 2 oclock for the left-seater or 11 oclock for the right-seater. After two major incidents/accidents in eight months are not all fractional owners, their employees and their families scared to hell for their own safety??? Could it happen to anyone else? Although never anywhere near 40 in the last two weeks have been in service. Furloughs.too bad. Closing the power levers to idle sounds the gear warning horn, which is canceled using a button on the RH power lever. .intend to return to the 121 world. Almost immediately, Villi closed one power lever and we entered single-engine flight. RMR, if you are in Vegas, have you looked at AirSprint as an alternative? So I took them up on their offer to find me a charter flight. At sea level under standard conditions, the Avanti II needs almost exactly the same amount of runway to land as it does to take off, just over 3,200 feet. This buffet, although it feels like a stick shaker through the column, is all aerodynamic from the forward wing and serves as an excellent stall warning. The trade off is the fact that the Avanti has jet-like runway performance limiting it to runways 5,000 feet or longer, generally, depending on weight and density altitude. As the flaps travel, there is a nose up pitch that is easily counteracted with slight forward pressure on the column and trim. With the hammer down and in the low 30s, Avanti IIs can hit 400 KTAS on 800 pounds per hour. Discretion being the better part of valor, I extended the gear early and reduced speed to deploy the flaps, intending to stabilize nice and early so I could concentrate on flying as accurately as possible. The P.180 Avanti Evo has a wow factor that is not present with many other twin turboprops of a similar size. P180 Avanti Pitot and Static System. The crew brought a crippled aircraft safely to the runway, but departed the runway with the crosswind condition. If range is the mission, getting the Avanti up to FL410 and cruising about 300 KTAS will yield a near-1,500 nautical mile range while still cruising as fast as the competition. But it didn't help in the fact VNR was born in the Decade from hell. At 10:21:49, there was 1000 feet of vertical separation and 0.9 nautical miles of lateral separation between the two aircraft. The Avanti takes that formula and pushes it to the design edge, achieving that performance with a great deal less power than in comparable jet products and with the best cabin in the class by a long shot. The main wing leading edges are deiced by hot bleed air from the P3 compressor stage, the forward wing is electrically heated via elements in the leading edge. It's because they MUST do it. Deviating from ICAO-compliant English, the controller told us, Piste libre before we lined up and discussed the departure. "Piaggio gets confirmation of Avanti speed records". AINonline. Aviation International News. Archived from the original on 5 September 2018. Retrieved 16 June 2017. ^ Aboulafia, Richard. To demonstrate the first stall, Villi leveled at 15,000 feet, and with the power levers remaining closed, we decelerated at 1.5 knots per second as shown by the purple trend vector on the PFD airspeed strip. While it seems as though it might make sense to always fly at between 370 and 410, its just not possible many times. But with a main cabin height of 69 inches, its easy to move about. For years, Avantis languished on the fringes of general aviation as a niche airplane. Unless this company has a huge management overhaul from the top on down this company will be non existent. Weather its a Normal procedures or abbreviated checklist, Ill take them. Later versions of the P.180 included the P.180 Avanti I and P.180 Avanti II. I have only been an owner for a short time but the flights I have taken have been flawless;The pilots seemed happy and very professional. Avantair and the Avanti have tremendous potential, if we make it. The unique rear mounted turboprop engines makes the Avanti instantly recognisable. The fuel penalty for flying in the 20s is not as extreme as it is in turbofan airplanes. Piaggios P180 Avanti created quite a splash with its 1990 certification in the United States. Both flights continued to their destinations without further incident. All this is combined with remarkable versatility, which makes the P180 Avanti II one of the most widely used aircraft in public services such as air ambulance and air rescue missions, law enforce-ment, and flight inspections that ensure the safety of people and property. If anyone in North Florida is interested let me know. In simpler terms, that means the engines maintain their 850 shaft horsepower to a higher altitude thereby increasing true airspeed of the airplane through the thinner air. Comments since yesterday, Oct. 25, seem oblivious to the safety of flight issues. I could see why 380 is a preferred altitude. The Avanti EVO is the fastest turboprop available currently. It wasnt the only fast turboprop twin with a forward wing the Beech Starship was a contemporary, though that company stopped production of the composite cabin-class twin shortly after it started it, admitting later that the composite model was so time-intensive to build that it was simply unprofitable. We are confident we are laying the groundwork necessary to offer outstanding service and reliability going forward.. I love the Piaggio and Avantair has always been great to work with, but now I am concerned about my share and their financial situation. In flight, the Avanti handles much like its competition, but the jet-like takeoff and landing speeds, lack of FADEC, narrow gear track, twitchy electric steering, and grabby carbon brakes combine to make the airplane more of a handful than your run-of-the-mill King Air or Cessna Conquest. Rockwell Collins Pro Line 21 avionics suite also debuted in the Avanti II. Villanova requires a specific qualification as it sits in a bowl surrounded by mountains with an MSA of 11,200 feet to the west, so Villi briefed he would fly the departure from Runway 9 and demonstrate a performance takeoff. These inspections and other actions are still underway. On the Avanti, each unique characteristic of the aircraft is firmly rooted in function. While it may be certified to fly with one pilot most P180s are crewed by two. We continued to decelerate and shortly after selecting landing flaps, I turned toward the hillside on my left to line up with the runway as we passed through 600 feet. Avantairs demise, parts scarcity, and maintenance headaches combine to make P180 ownership a challenge. Theoretically, a newly minted multiengine pilot with a high-altitude endorsement could hop right in and go flying. You can get a good 2003 model with the increased weights that make it an Avanti II for $5.3. I picked up the Avantair share as a resale through a vendor and paid a lot less then what it would have cost to buy it directly from the company, so at least I'm invested at a much lower number. Avanti II appeared for the 2006 model year with higher thermodynamically rated engines. How do I get out of my lease and is there an opportunity for owners to get together to take action? Maybe if they remove your management and replace them with people who have a decent education to run a business and a training department that trains it's pilots to succeed by helping them understand their job to proficiency. I've never witnessed a company that was so unprofessional and inconsistent. While I flew, Villi checked the Airplane Flight Manual and the performance graphs corroborated these figures to within a couple of knots at ISA +5. On the ground, however, the Avantis overflight noise footprint is on the high scale, which is typical of pusher designs. But it was not his fault that it. Whatever the outcome, it was and is an honor and a blast to serve our Owners and work with my fellow VNR employees. The original $5.00 stock traded at .11 cents today, a loss of 98% of its value. Pilot Report: Piaggio Avanti Evo - Aviation International The pitch trim is activated by first pushing in the thumb hat control on the outboard horn of the control wheel and then moving the switch in the desired direction. Piaggio P.180 AFM TC No. So it was no surprise that my first impressions were of relatively high control forces with noticeable system friction in both pitch and roll with, at low speed, a low geared pitch trim. The continuous curve of the fuselage generates approximately one-third of the overall lift, reducing the required size of the wings and thus minimizing drag. Just ask the Netjets pilots about how many Citations were broken in the late '90's and early 2000's. Its also remarkably wide for an airplane of its size. In fact, Avantair hired and added airplanes during the Great Recession. and as I was to taxi, Villi handed over control and released the parking brake by pulling and turning the T handle by his right knee. Please contact me at the e-mail address below if you are interested. I can't speak for the maintenance personnel involved in this, but I know that the pilot and co-pilot were both fired for failure to perform a pre-flight check. I started looking at commercial flights, figuring SWA flies there and it would be inexpensive anyway. I know if they fold up its going to be a fiasco as technically we each own a piece of these airplanes so we have a bunch of partners that we don't even know. We leveled off at FL350 19 minutes after takeoff, I left the torque at 75 percent, and allowed the Avanti to accelerate to Mach 0.64 with an indicated airspeed of 216 knots and a TAS of 373 knots. The use of alloys instead of composites was a purposeful choice for Piaggio Aero, which certified the airplane more than 20 years ago at a time when there were few successful composite models and sheet metal seemed to augur a shorter approval program than plastics did. RMR, I'm in Jacksonville Florida but I am going so start looking for a partner or two to buy something together. From the beginning, Piaggio Aero intended the Avanti to be a turboprop that played in the same niche as light jets but with better economy and a larger cabin. Cabin dimensions are spacious compared to a Beechcraft King Air and more in line with a midsize jet. At 160 knots, he handed control over to me, and we climbed at 2,500 fpm. Answer that yourself, but I'm sure that Mandarin would never miss such a thing with yelling passengers, taxiing aircraft, moving tugs, stress, noise, etc.. Interestingly, the windscreen de-fog system is set up for single- It was fast-paced fun, and once again I had to remind myself that there were props somewhere back there, especially when I noticed our initial rate of climb was pushing 3,000 fpm. Acceleration feels fast, but steering through the rudders is positive and smooth, though it requires an easy touch to avoid darting about. Really thinking nothing of it, I booked a flight from LAS to Orange COunty Ca today (coming back tomorrow). As far as the crew that experienced the elevator loss, now you will hear the rest of the story.. Due to low ceilings at the destination airport, the crew diverted to the alternate, SAN. But this further action is necessary to ensure every aspect of our operation will allow us to reach the next level of safety and performance and exceed the highest industry standard, said Steven Santo, Avantair CEO. Reaching ahead between the forward cabin bulkhead, he lifted the left-side pilots seat to provide a clear floor area on which to stand. First, the gear came down below 180 knots, then mid- and finally full-stage flaps and we were nicely stabilized at 500 feet. With all of these maitenence issues and issues regarding fudging pilot hours so they would be legal is scary. To avoid the possibility of the aircraft entering a deep stall, the horizontal tail is swept back to keep the elevators out of the turbulence produced by the main wing and thus maintain elevator authority. The seats are finished in black leather with the owners initials embossed into the headrest and with a cabin height of 5.74 ft, it is comfortable to move around the full length. Villi and I then headed to Genoa for some instrument approaches. WebSECTION A: GENERAL, P.180 Avanti Type Design A.I. The engines have pneumatic boots on the intake combining with an engine particle deviator door to avoid ice entering the engine core and a warm bleed air supply to the engine oil cooler intake. Hah, you think the owners don't care about safety? WebThis rare Piaggio P-180 Avanti is an Italien executive transport aircraft with twin turboprop engines mounted in pusher configuration. Villi led the way, providing an excellent demonstration. Its a hard transition for a pilot coming back to PT6s after having flown modern fadec turbofans from Williams and, yes, from Pratt & Whitney. I for one an very hopeful this whole episode will be behind us soon and that the company becomes gets stronger. It just so happens to be one of the most unusual looking ones too. On approach, however, the view is excellent. The airplane has been constantly improved over the past decade, with new interiors, higher max takeoff weight, higher Vmo and avionics upgrades galore. Your management sucks! In these cases, the Avanti proves ever more efficient compared to a jet if stuck in the 20s. I know from my perspective, it was going to be close as to whether I was going to use my minimum hours this year (even after being able to roll some to next year). I would especially reach out to Mr. Norris and others and hope that we will be able to serve you again in the future. The forward wing (not to be called a canard, as it has no moving flight controls other than forward flaps) is positioned on the underside of a gracefully sweeping nose and is home to two pitot tubes underneath and, unusually in Western types, has a significant anhedral. Other parts, mainly fairings and the like, are composite, but for the most part, Piaggio Aeros Avanti II is a sheet metal airplane. At 73 inches across, the width allows for great shoulder room, easy entry though the airstair door and a very comfy hard-door lavatory. A friend owns a That said both the plane and the company have been reliable for me for about 7 years. The approach speeds are very fast by turboprop standards. WebThats why the Piaggio Aero P180 Avanti II is a green aircraft. WebPiaggio Avanti New Price: $7,399,500 Seats: 9 Calculate Loan Payments Aircraft valuation for older models and your trade in Overview The Piaggio Avanti flies as fast and high as some corporate jets while burning about 30 percent less fuel, and its distinctive looks and Italian styling make it stand out on any ramp. Safety is Avantairs top priority. pilots. In reality, the P.180 is a fast, sophisticated, high-flying airplane that requires the same kinds of skills and training as any single-pilot business jet. They offered to find me a charter at MY EXPENSE, which just isn't right. Web Conserve water to avoid overloading the septic system. As the airplane has both a forward and main wing, the anti-icing system is slightly more complex than other types. https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/business-aviation/2012-10-23/avantair-grounds-entire-fleet-safety-checks, It was ground the fleet for inspection or get shutdown my the FAA. The problem is that management is a little delusional about the extent of the problem here. Taxiing feels conventional, though its accomplished using an electrically actuated, hydraulically powered nosewheel steering system. Thanks for point that out. While canard configurations like the Beechcraft Starship were gaining a lot of attention back then, the exotic Avanti begged to be even more different with its three-lifting-surface arrangement versus the canards tail-forward setup. View our Piaggio P.180 Avanti II photo gallery. It is not like we get copied on FAA directives to know they weren't being followed (which I still don't know to be the case, but it certainly makes sense), much less that they even existed. With the stick fully back, we reached 100 knots indicated but once again, as I released the back pressure and smoothly applied power, we recovered. The problem with the aft mounting is that the Avanti II has a very distinct exterior noise signature that is problematic while by all accounts the Avanti II is no noisier than other PT6-powered twins. We are grateful for their understanding and patience as we work through this important process. When Flying first flew the Avanti in 1990, we predicted that its great fuel efficiency would be a big selling point, and that has been true. Landing the P.180, as Id heard previously, is interesting in that the attitude is very flat. Think of the Avanti II as a jet with props and youll be close to the mark, though in many respects, its not an easy mental shift to make. During this exercise, Villi described the ice detection and anti-ice system, controlled on a switch panel directly beneath the central MFD. PT6A-66(B) The P180s have a lot of maintenance issues because they are flown to airliner annual times when the planes were only made for a few hundred hours a year with private owners. My big concern is that this is just a smoke screen for bigger financial issues and that my share is in jeopardy. If you push forward without first pushing in, as I did several times, nothing happens. During the stand-down, Avantair will furlough some employees. With our new processes and procedures, Avantair will satisfy the heightened requirements governing the largest aircraft types in our industry. If this had happened at a big passenger airline, they would have been lauded for getting the aircraft to the runway. It is, instead, a forward wing. New eVTOL Aircraft Set to Co-exist Alongside Helicopters, Safran Signals 'War for Talent' within Civil Engine Aftermarket, Newly Certified HAL 228 Variant Attracts Indian Lessor, Vision Systems Brings Dimmable-window Solutions to Heli-Expo, Cessna Citation II: The 'Family Truckster', Training Providers Gear Up for AAM Market, A modest proposal to boost general aviation, FAA Should Use Its Nuclear Option To Save Americas Airports, Analyzing the GAMA 1Q10 aircraft delivery numbers, Mid-Year Aerospace & Air Transport Report. Pete Bedell is a pilot for a major airline and co-owner of a Cessna 172M and Beechcraft Baron D55. Flying the Avanti II General Data Sheet No. WebThe Piaggio P180 Avanti II twin-engine turboprop business aircraft is the successor to the P180 Avanti, of which more than 100 have been produced since its entry into service in What we didnt fully realize is that over the next 20 years no light jet would emerge that could challenge the P.180s remarkable combination of speed, fuel efficiency and cabin size, a trifecta of strengths that has made it a popular transportation airplane with operators for whom efficiency, comfort and high style are the hallmarks of having arrived. In any event, they are going to be fighting an uphill battle, as each day that passes is going to cause people to want to cancel there "membership.". WebPostaccident examination revealed both nose gear tires were deflated, and the right main tire had low air pressure. It pulled the concept off. You know get them off the insurance roll. On first glimpse, the cabin interior is impressive, with a two-place bench seat opposite the door, a single sideways-facing seat on the same side as the door and four club-arranged seats leading to a full privacy toilet. During the takeoff roll, the left elevator departed the airplane and was found off the side of the runway 3 days later. If not, we hope that you find safe, efficient, and cost-effective travel options in the future. A most serious maintenance error especially since the elevator installation work would have required a RII type (double) inspection. The second records shows a Piaggio P-180 Grant has been flying the Avanti for years with thousands of hours of experience in the airplane, much of it under typical charterlike conditions. Slightly heavy control forces in roll assisted me in flying this accurately. I am under a recent lease agreement. The effect is a view that changes substantially as you point the nose up or down in various phases of flight. 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